All of the following emails were sent to the entire Caroga Town Board, with a copy of those emails sent here.
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Clubhouse project feedback
Dear Town Board and Town Clerk,
I believe the most recent proposal to move the town maintenance facility south of it's current location is a very logical idea. Not only would it relocate an eyesore off the highway, away from the golf course, it would hopefully eliminate pollution runoff into Irving Creek and thus Canada Lake and allow for more flexibility in arranging a new golf clubhouse facility and parking.
I doubt anyone in the county, beyond county employee families, will accept the $10,000,000 estimated price tag. Of course, there's always hope for some extraordinary creativity to produce funding, but that seems more miracle than logic at this point.
I, too, am very concerned with the lack of proven "expertise" being demonstrated by Mr. Horton. The lack of transparency in the cost discovery process is extremely concerning. It seems a major portion of the past year and a half have been squandered bickering instead of being open and honest with the process. I find the lack of resident input very disturbing. We're the ones who use the golf course and have supported it the last 50 years.
We're also the the people who have not been made aware of past seepage of pollutants into Irving Creek and Canada Lake. Why has it taken until now to even make this potential issue public? And, how will the town remedy what's already been done to harm our water bodies?
I'd like to see the official inclusion of public opinion fully supported from this point onward, without limitation of attendence or voice. I'd also like to see any and all financial decisions be approved by residents of Fulton County by proxy vote or other such method. If town officials are elected to represent residents, then they shouldn't be opposed to hearing and listening to these same voices throughout this process.
I'm still not clear how the new golf clubhouse got entangled into a discussion of a new Town Hall and maintenance facility. These should be separate projects with separate budgets. I find it ridiculous that a new,
simple clubhouse and cart storage area couldn't be erected for less than $1,000,000. It may take longer to accomplish, but there are plenty of builders out there offering beautiful timber frame structures that would be fantastic somewhere on that current site. A cart facility is even simpler.
https://timberframe1.com/non-residential-timberframe-structures/timberframe-clubhouses/
https://www.precisioncraft.com/regions/us/new-york.html
https://www.timberframesinc.com/
Please expand your planning process to be 100% transparent and publicly scrutinized. We won't sponsor secret projects with outrageous price tags.
We are Fulton County, not Lake Placid. We love and appreciate the simplicity of what we had and don't want to be beholden to overly ambitious town officials more than willing to bury it's residents under ornerous debt burden to fund their dream workplace. We want smart, efficient use of funding. We want to retain the unique simplicity of historical Nick Stoner G.C.. And, we want to bring prosperity and joy to visitors and residents without being manipulated by an authoritarian government.
Work with us. It's not your town. We share this beautiful, Adirondack gem equally. Have the decency and integrity to partner with us and keep our amazing town a joy to visit.
Respectfully,
George R. III Canada Lake seasonal resident and Nick Stoner golfer
Dear Town Board and Town Clerk,
I heard about how much the Golf Course Clubhouse/Town Hall is going to cost but, I never hear how much insurance money the town will receive or has already received for the fire. Is it enough to offset the building cost?
Also, if this plan included the relocation of the Town's Highway Department and demolition, then the people of the town would be more respective. But the town keeps adding on to this project. First it was just the Clubhouse, then it became the Clubhouse and the Town Hall.. Now you want to move the Highway Department to a different location which will cost money to build and may cost to buy/lease the land if we do not own it already. Then, we have to demo both the Highway Department Building and the Town Hall Building. Just a how much more are you, the Town, going to add on. It is not just your money you are dealing with. Just a concerned citizen of the town,
Karen L. Morlock
222 Fulton Road
Caroga Lake, NY 12032
Dear Town Board and Town Clerk,
We live at 112 Irving Pond Road, just across from the proposed club house/town hall location. We ask that nighttime lighting of the site be as limited as possible.
Jim and Lisa Miller
Dear Town Board and Town Clerk,
I have read Mr. Horton's presentation and am troubled that the Board is considering a proposal to dramatically expand a straightforward golf course clubhouse rebuilding project of several hundred thousand dollars funded primarily by insurance proceeds to a multi-million-dollar project covering several buildings without a clearly identified source of funds.
My family owns a summer camp on Canada Lake that was built in the 1800s. My grandfather purchased the camp in the 1940s. We have spent a portion of every summer there since 1953. My family including my uncle Lutz Mueller from Little Falls have played golf regularly at Nick Stoner since the 1950s. He was a good friend of Jimmy Remington. Pictures of them together hung in the 19th Hole for decades. Thus, rebuilding the clubhouse is important to us.
Maintaining our property is also of great importance to me and my family with our adult children now having children of their own and desiring to pass their fond childhood memories on to them. Although we are not "residents" of the Town we have dutifully paid our taxes including taxes for a school no one in four generations has ever attended. Those additional taxes placed a significant strain on our ability to maintain our camp. Mr. Horton does not identify a viable means of paying for his proposal which, if adopted, will very likely increase those taxes to the point that we must dispose of our historic camp. Thus, we urge the Board to reject Mr. Horton's multi-structure proposal and focus solely on rebuilding the golf course clubhouse with insurance proceeds.
Sincerely,
Jon Mueller
204 Fulton Road
Caroga Lake, NY 12032
Dear Town Board and Town Clerk,
All taxpayers and voters deserve transparency and full disclosure on your plans.
Please confirm that 5/11 mtg will be available via Zoom, especially with covid on the rise again.
Chris Rohrs
Dear Town Board and Town Clerk,
It appears that the upcoming Town meeting set for May 11 at 6 P.M. will not be transmitted via Zoom. Does this mean that the 12-person cap for attending the meeting has increased even with the uptick of Covid cases in our area?
Looking forward to hearing from you,
Deb Hoffman
Dear Town Board and Town Clerk,
Please provide Zoom access for the 20 May meeting. Also, can you clarify for Caroga taxpayers exactly:
1) How much insurance money has been received to date for the Clubhouse fire? And
2) What is the total projected cost of the new Clubhouse/Town Hall building?Thank you,
Barbara Russell
Hutchinson Road
Dear Town Board and Town Clerk,
We do need a new clubhouse and I somewhat agree with a new town hall but, we do not need a full kitchen and banquet room. It also can be smaller and a simple roof. It does not need all those fancy peeks on the roof. I would hope that you listen to the people who pay the taxes. Thank you,
Karen Morlock
222 Fulton Road
Caroga Lake, NY
Dear Town Board and Town Clerk,
After months of following this sad saga - thanks to James Long for the regular, and frustrating, updates - I have just two questions. Why is Supervisor Horton not being held to account for not adhering to the law?
Does he not answer to anybody who is a right thinking person? It is all quite shocking and disturbing. Disgusting, actually.Joanne Clark
327 Kasson Drive
Canada Lake, NY
Dear Town Board and Town Clerk,
I have followed the Golf course drama since the Jennings situation and then the fire! Like others who have expressed concerns, I have spent part of the last 74 years at the lake and my family has enjoyed years of playing at Nick Stoner. This is my home!
And again, like so many others, I want the town to be vibrant and thriving. Generating income locally of course, is a great idea! But, I am not invested in building a grand structure to attract better people quoting Supervisor Horton from the town transcript provided in the Caroga News Flash! They are already living here! They are already playing the course, eating and drinking in our local establishments.
The insurance money, the changing numbers, creates the appearance of a shell game! A straightforward approach informing all residents of the actual cost, the actual insurance payment YTD, etc. would be helpful and may help inform and educate voters and residents. The potential for grants to fund more than half the total cost of the grand structure seems unlikely. In our current economic climate I never hear anyone say they would love to pay higher taxes! The idea that the golf course will double its revenue against a huge debt seems preposterous! If the project requires a vote, how and when will the public be notified of such a vote?
Further, changing the configuration of the course itself, which is also being considered, will destroy many of the reasons Nick Stoner is popular. Its challenging but playable for the most serious golfers!
In the due diligence period has anyone inquired about the return on investment for the golf simulators? Have any of the town board members used the ones that are locally available? How much are they used in the off season? Again, I question the veracity of the financial gains projected without some boots on the ground information and not just from vendors!
Big projects like the proposed clubhouse/town hall are costly, absolutely! It seems like leg work that should have been done, like canvassing community members, has not been effective and that rumors abound! The results are rumors, missteps, accusations, and suspicion. And who knows about the fiscal responsibilities the board has?
Community means a group of people who share similar goals and work together to achieve them! A return to the notion of community as the foundation of all of decisions made by the current board could take us a long way to a healthy, vibrant and wholesome community. Please, listen to your neighbors!
Margaret B.
160 Sand Point Rd.
M. Julia Butler
Dear Town Board and Town Clerk,
Thank you for the Frequently asked questions! Much easier read!
The $8 increase in taxes…how was that determined?
Are you still considering a referendum to raise the revenue to complete the project?
Are you considering written job descriptions for town positions specifically the golf course? That may have helped derail the current personnel issue?????)
To increase play the notion that the club house and simulators will attract new members hence more revenue is questionable especially if simple market research of clubs at least 50 miles from Albany has not been part of the process!
Is anyone on the current board aware that a plan was created for the town to build a new club house? It was created by a local architect. Was that option ever discussed ?
Thank you for taking the time to read this intentionally. Caroga is a unique little community with greater visibility and diversity each summer!
I implore the board to determine how realistic the new plans/structure for golf and town offices really is! And to consider always, how any of the plans proposed impact residents and seasonal visitors! I think we can agree that each voice matters! Thats a critical component of growing healthy community Julia Butler
160 Sand Point Rd Canada Lake
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M. Julia Butler
Dear Town Board and Town Clerk,
I believe that you are really trying to build everything that the town needs but, we do not need a town hall and golf course combo that looks like that for that kind of money. Just keep it simple and up to code and safe for all the town's employees.
Karen Morlock
222 Fulton Road, Caroga Lake, NY 12032
518-835-8619
Dear Town Board and Town Clerk, We would like to go on record as being opposed to the building of a Salt Shed on the property that is so close to private residences. There are documented cases of ground water contamination due to the salt sheds. The noise this summer from all the construction vehicles has been terrible as well When we moved here in 1986 we were told that the land was donated for recreational purposes only. We were opposed to the Town petitioning the State to change that and are still opposed. Mark and Doreen Ford
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