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Here is a news segment on News 10 with an interview with Supervisor Scott Horton and an audio clip with Board Member James McMartin Long on the elimination of Zoom meetings.
With the Town Board voting November 4, 2020 to discontinue Zoom meetings, Town Board member James McMartin Long has sent a Notice pursuant to Open Meetings Law and Executive Orders 202.1 and 202.15 to assert his right to participate in Town Board meetings as a Town Board member remotely.
The Town Board on November 10, 2020 voted to partially restart Zoom meetings in the future. For regular meetings, the Zoom public would be allowed to listen but not speak, unlike those persons attending in person. Disallowing the Zoom participants from speaking but not the in-person participants is in violation of New York State Public Officers Law, Article 7, Open Meetings Law, as modified by Executive Orders 202.1 and 202.15 and extended by various Executive Orders including 202.72. (Public Hearings require a virtual meeting option, e.g., Zoom, under the above.)
We strongly oppose the Caroga Town Board’s decision to hold in person meetings in the near future. Under the State’s Phase IV guidelines, indoor public meetings need to be limited to 50 attendees. At the November 4 meeting, around 40 family units participated with many units composed of multiple family members. To conform to State guidelines, the board would have to restrict attendance which would be counter to the nature of a public hearing.
Respectfully,
Tracey and William Hay
To the Board:
The decision to stop holding meetings over Zoom is unacceptable. Restricting attendance to 50 persons, all of whom would be risking their health to attend, is not in keeping with the mandate that town business be conducted in public.
As a resident, I wish to attend the November 7 board meeting via Zoom.
Sincerely,
Elizabeth Faber
November 5, 2020
Dear Supervisor Horton:
I want to express my strong opposition to the decision by the Town Board to suspend Zoom meetings. Teleconference meetings have offered the opportunity for greater public engagement and transparency in town governance. As public officials you should value this opportunity to make your meetings more accessible to your constituents. This accessibility is especially important in a community like Caroga where a good number of your voting constituents live elsewhere during the winter months. I sense from the board’s actions that the public’s questions and scrutiny made board members uncomfortable. Such public discussion is not a “conspiracy” as one member expressed, but in the spirit of the best democratic principles. Zoom is democratic and not “communist” as one board member was heard to say.
Zoom teleconferences have been especially important this year with the threat of Covid. Many constituents and even board members are uncomfortable attending a public meeting held in a space like the Caroga town hall. Considering the current concerns with a resurgence of the virus as we go into the winter months, the town board should take all the necessary steps to protect the public. To attend in person board meetings, residents would have to make the difficult decision to risk their own health. To follow the State’s Phase IV guidelines, the board would need to limit attendance to 50 people which would limit public participation in what are intended to be public meetings. The November 4 meeting had over 40 families attend by Zoom. Considering that multiple family members participated, the board would have to exclude people from attending future meetings.
I ask you to reconsider your unfortunate decision and serve the public interest.
Respectfully,
Allen S. Farber
222 Sand Point Road, Canada Lake
Dear Sirs:
So disappointed that you made the decision to suspend the Zoom (budget and regular) Board meetings I truly felt connected to the Town with this virtual access. I am not a year-round resident but certainly pay my fair share of taxes. The past few meetings have had between 30 and 55 residents participate, therefore there must be some real interest in the workings of our Town. I find it distressing that you have chosen to shut out seasonal residents. I believe we make up a large portion of the population and feel we should be included in your decision process. I can only come to the conclusion that transparency is not on the agenda.
I would hope that you would reconsider your decision and continue with the Zoom meetings for those of us who are unable to make to trip to Caroga.
Regards,
Deb Hoffman
115 Old State Road
Canada Lake NY 12032
This pandemic is not a joke. Zoom meetings protect everyone. Group meetings are dangerous. Please reconsider your decision.
Dick Loomis
101 Hutchinson Rd.
Dear Town Clerk and Town Board Members,
I understand a decision has been made to discontinue Town Board meetings via zoom. Please know I am disappointed with this decision. You know I have attended board meetings over the years but have been unable this year due to COVID-19. I have very vulnerable family members and friends.
I am asking the board to reconsider this decision. It is your responsibility as the leaders in our community to take care of your residents. Please do not put us at risk.
Also, I hope you would be pleased to have had an increase in resident participation via zoom from all over the United States this year. They have been thrilled to stay in touch with the Town Of Caroga during the fall and upcoming winter season. They are now very upset that you have taken that away from them. Why? I hope you would consider being leaders in our area and set and example to other Town Boards in the Adirondacks by maintaining communication via Zoom for all future board meetings. COVID or not. Thank you for your time.
Kathy Manning
232 Green Lake Road, Caroga
Dear Caroga Town Board,
I’ve been trying to participate in the public meetings, particularly with regard to recent discussion about a wild increase in property. It was unbelievable to hear, this morning, that Zoom meetings have been discontinued — during a pandemic, while addressing a financial crisis.
Hoping you can address both these issues rapidly:
1) delay a tax increase/use contingency funds until a workable long-term plan can be developed, and
2) bring back Zoom teleconferencing.This is a democracy already under enough pressure.
Thank you,
Ward V. Halverson, LCSW-R, M.Ed., Director
Cornerstone Herkimer, LLC
417 East German Street, Herkimer, NY 13350
(315) 868-1000 fax: (315) 866-1046
www.cornerstoneherkimer.org
Please continue posting the Board Meetings via the internet. For those of us that are not able to attend meetings due to Covid or distance, it is very helpful to those of us who are stakeholders in the Town of Caroga.
Karen Gniewek Conklin
To whom it may concern,
We recently learned of the suspension of Town Board Zoom meetings.
I would like to understand the reasoning behind this step backwards.
Because of the pandemic conditions it would seem that Zoom meetings are the only reasonable, safe and equitable way of holding a public meeting. This is both due to the restrictions on gatherings of a certain size, and the undue risk to meet even under these conditions. But almost as important, it is well known that many of the home owners in the area spend limited time at their homes outside the summer months, and even then many are limited to weekends. When meetings are not held by Zoom there is practically no way for myself and many others to even consider attending even in non-pandemic conditions. As such, not using simple and reliable technology to allow remote attendance of the meetings is tantamount to discrimination. It would seem this decision should be reversed immediately.
Sincerely,
Nick Gale
I recently had the opportunity to attend a Caroga Lake Town Meeting via Zoom and was impressed with the orderly manner in which the meeting was conducted.
I can’t imagine why the Caroga Town Board would decide to not make its meetings available via Zoom in a community with many seasonal residents during a worldwide pandemic.
I oppose this decision and would urge you to continue to provide remote access to future public meetings.
Regards,
Richard T. Fischer
155 Kasson Drive
Please resume Zoom meetings.
Nancy and Courtney Young, 137 Dolgeville Pt, Caroga Lake, NY 12032
Good day!
I’d like to thank the Board for all of your hard work and for allowing residents to participate in meetings this year virtually due to the COVID pandemic. I understand that after the recent meeting, this convenient and safe option will no longer be offered. I am a year-round resident and have recently started to become more involved in the community, partly thanks to this option, as I’m often not home from work in time to attend the meetings but can call in on the drive back.
I also reside with my parents, who are older and at-risk for COVID.
Additionally, I will have to travel for a few weeks this fall to complete an academic course in Florida that had been postponed in spring. I planned to quarantine as per state mandate upon my return, which will require me to miss an additional meeting should I observe the quarantine strictly.
Given the current state of things, denying virtual access seems like a huge risk as well as an inconvenience to the public, while I can see no justifiable reason NOT to offer it as an option. It would seem as though, as our representatives, you would appreciate public interest and involvement. Many of those who called in to the last meeting offered reasonable points of view and even constructive suggestions for moving forward- is this not the goal of town government?
I write this email in the hope that you will reconsider restricting access to public meetings in the face of a devastating pandemic. Should that not be the case, I request a reasonable explanation of your decision otherwise.
Thanks again, and enjoy this sunny weekend!
Allyson Corr
313 Kasson Drive
Dear Town Board and Town Clerk,
I am disappointed with the decision to discontinue Zoom access to public meetings of the Town of Caroga. Despite Covid (do not downplay this virus yet) and whatever internal squabbles the board seems to be having (my opinion only) you are missing the boat on this one. One thing learned by many during this time of great adaptation is the value of alternate forms of communication. Who cares what the other guy is doing. Zoom access to meetings is extremely important to non-fulltime/summer residents who want to be part of all things Caroga with an eye on the future. Keeping the zoom access and encouraging more individual attendance would send a message to all of your tax payers that you want them to be part of the re-vitalization you envision. I truly hope you decide to move in this progressive direction and not move back toward a time when most important town decisions were tabled until a large portion of the tax base was not in town to be able to attend meetings personally.
Respectfully yours,
Donald Hopper
156 South Shore West Caroga Road (Proudly since 1967)
To CL Board.
With the recent years of contentious relationships between the town board and many community members it seems like it would be an important gesture towards community healing (if that’s possible) to provide the greatest access to how the town conducts business with transparency so perhaps some semblance of civility, respect, and trust can be restored. As was mentioned in the last zoom meeting many of us are seasonal residents but love CL and want the best for the community. I have been coming to the lake for 73 years and was once a year round resident. CL is a unique and special place not only for me, my family but for many others who have an interest In the health of our lakes and community but not a vote. We rely on our elected officials to do what’s right without serving their own interests. Recognizing that would seem to suggest that greater participation will lead to better outcomes! ZOOM makes this kind of engagement possible.
Increasing taxes at this time seems like folly when so many of our community are already struggling financially. I understand the budget was adopted and I was hoping that the fund balance could be used to provide some tax relief. I am sad to see kids’ programming eliminated too.
It appears short sighted to abandon ZOOM as a method of communication when in a functioning democracy all voices are important and need to be heard. I urge you to reconsider.
Thank you for serving on our town board and taking the time to thoughtfully consider my remarks.
Sincerely,
Margaret Butler
160 S Shore Rd.
I support the further use of zoom meetings for the foreseeable future. Zoom meetings provide residents access to meetings for all sorts of reasons.
I oppose the elimination of the zoom meeting option for Town Board meetings.
Board: We strongly protest your decision to cut off citizen and taxpayer participation by cancelling zoom meetings.
Your decision to so is bad governance. Why are you doing it??
Chris and Kathy Rohrs
Dear Town Board and Town Clerk,
Having virtual Town Board meetings available has been both helpful and informative. So many taxpayers, who would not otherwise be able to attend meetings, have had an opportunity to hear discussions, have input, and better understand Town Board decisions. The decision to discontinue them is baffling and unsafe. It was stated by Supervisor Horton, at the Public Hearing earlier this week, that there is no threat of COVID in Caroga Lake. Do we live in an impenetrable bubble? The threat is increasing everywhere and will only increase here with in person meetings and public attendance. I’m especially surprised that the doctor on the Board would support this decision. Discounting James Long’s valid, and medically supported concerns is troubling. The Board is, in effect, making it impossible for him to attend meetings of the Board to which he was elected.
I am urging the Board to reverse its decision.
If Zoom is not workable, there are alternatives that can be considered, such as GoToMeeting, and WebEx. I’m sure there are others as well and one that will work can be found.
Respectfully,
Genia Meinhold
168 S Shore Rd
W Caroga
Please continue to offer access to the town meetings via Zoom. I live with a vulnerable family member so, with COVID cases on the rise, would rather not drive three hours round-trip (from an area with more COVID cases than Caroga has) to attend the meetings in person. The Zoom meetings have given me a greater understanding and respect for the challenging work of running a town, and I am excited to see Caroga move forward with some of the good ideas brought up in the meetings.
Best regards,
Dorothy Taylor
358 South Shore Trail - Canada Lake
Hello,
We love our hike-in/boat-in cabin on Canada Lake, but we are not able to attend non-summer town meetings because it is not a year-round residence.
We greatly appreciate that Zoom has been an option during the COVID-19 pandemic and humbly request that you continue offering a video participation option — both because SARS-CoV-2 infection rates are again on the rise and because Zoom offers all property owners the ability to participate in local decisions that affect our summer home, regardless of distance, weather conditions, or access to transportation.
Thank you for considering keeping modern technology in the mix for more truly representative participation in the governance process of a very special part of NY.
All good wishes,
Erika Ehmsen
Canada Lake (Caroga), NY
I oppose the elimination of the zoom meeting option for Town Board meetings.
Mr. Scott Horton
Supervisor, Town Of CarogaNovember 6, 2020
Mr. Horton,
The 4:1 vote and decision to discontinue Zoom Town Board Meetings in favor of in-person meetings, 11/4/20, seems to be an aggressive behavior directed toward Caroga residents. It greatly restricts the attendance of Town residents, for those with:
- personal health concerns
- at risk family members
- respect for CDC recommendations
- seasonal homes, living part of the year at a distance
Social distance seating could be arranged in the building’s gym, however, that doesn’t allow participation of those with the above concerns.
Town Meetings are open to the public. Those attending have the opportunity to participate in discussion, and ideas can be exchanged. Ideally, town board members and townspeople work together for the good of their community. Such ideas are the platforms board candidates run on. When you ran for election to the Board earlier this year, your shared concerns and intentions were hopeful; not exclusionary. I hope you will reconsider your decision to discontinue the Zoom meetings, and let the community join you.
Mary and Joseph Jablonski
115 Hutchinson Rd
Caroga Lake NY
Dear Town Board and Town Clerk,
It was with great sadness and dismay that I listened to the Town Board’s 4-1 decision to end Zoom monthly meetings. You were elected to support the community that elected you, not to show indifference for our health and/or our opinions. I ask that you reconsider a decision that appears to be both nontransparent and a complete disregard for the interests and well-being of others.
Nancy L. Purcell
Dear Town Board and Town Clerk:
I have been made aware of the Board’s recent decision to discontinue Zoom access to board meetings from this point forward.
Regrettably, I must again use the word unconscionable to describe this latest move by the majority of the Board members. I’m certainly not in a position to attend board meetings in person, as I am older and a diabetic. Furthermore, having recently lost my husband to COVID-19, I’m not about to put myself, or anyone else, at risk. First, you decided to arbitrarily mute the members of the public who wanted to speak at the virtual meetings, and now you are making it impossible to attend without risking their safety. One of you runs a take-out restaurant in town and certainly can’t validly claim that you do not regularly come into contact with the public. Another of you is a practicing physician who certainly should be aware of the risks associated with bringing people together in a public setting. The fact that the Town of Caroga has thus far been lucky enough to escape the scourge of COVID-19 is a completely insufficient rationalization to force people to choose between their right to participate in local government and their right to protect their health. I am sure that you are fully aware of how many property owners, some of whom are residents but all of whom are taxpayers, were granted access to and the ability to participate in local government via Zoom. This decision to eliminate that access clouds this administration, and deprives a large number of people to easy and immediate access to information and input. I fail to understand how this benefits anyone other than a Board that is more interested in obfuscation than openness.
One does not need a third party to operate audio and video components for a Zoom meeting, and to claim that is the reason for no longer affording the public this access is ridiculous. If you are intelligent enough to run the Town of Caroga you are certainly intelligent enough to learn how to use this simplistic technology. Furthermore, to claim that no other governmental entities in Fulton County are doing this (which is NOT true as of today, according to the Leader Herald) is childish and irrelevant, and a clear attempt to rationalize a poor decision. This smacks of disingenuousness. Once again we seem to be reverting to the practice of previous boards who waited until the fall and winter months when all of the seasonal residents and snowbirds left town to ram through their agendas without concern for or input from taxpayers.
I also wish to express my disappointment at your decision to pass the proposed 2021 budget with insufficient reductions in spending, and to vote to exceed the tax cap so that you could significantly increase taxes. We do not need multiple thousands of dollars set aside for “celebrations” which, in light of the current status of the pandemic, are not likely to be permitted. With approximately a million-dollar surplus in town coffers, raising taxes at all in this financial climate is, again, unconscionable. You were elected, not to run our town as an autocracy, oblivious to what is desired by and in the best interests of its citizens, but to do what is best for the townspeople, listening and responding to our concerns. Playing a financial long game now, in these volatile times, is not appropriate. Forcing people to pay more taxes right now is fiscally unsound and unnecessary when there is sufficient money available to take care of necessary services. You are making decisions that are exceptionally tone-deaf right now.
With all due respect, I urge you to resume public access to all town meetings via Zoom. I also request that you eliminate unnecessary spending and refrain from raising taxes. The people who put their trust in you and elected you surely did not anticipate these poor choices.
Very truly yours,
Barbara S. Lee, Esq.
West Caroga Lake
Dear Supervisor Horton, Members of the Town Board and Town Clerk:
My wife and I attended the Zoom meeting of the Town Board on November 4th and were very dismayed by Supervisor Horton’s motion to discontinue Zoom meetings of the Board in the future.
My wife and her sister are co-owners of property on the South Shore of Canada Lake. Their parents bought that property in 1953 and four generations of our families have enjoyed spending summers there over these many years. We have paid thousands and thousands of dollars in property taxes and have supported the local economy through purchases of goods and services during that time.
We live in California and have made the pilgrimage each year — except for this year due to the Covid-19 pandemic. It is not at all reasonable to force elderly folks to go out in public in these perilous times in order to attend Town Board meetings when a very viable and lower risk alternative is available. Zoom meetings have been demonstrated as being very effective in encouraging participation by a larger number of community members, even those who would not otherwise have been able to attend because of distance, physical limitations or inclement weather.
Supervisor Horton was heard to say during last Wednesday’s meeting something to the effect that he wanted “to reduce public participation in order to limit open discussion and cause less disruption.” (I would like to have access to a recording of that meeting so as to be able to quote him more accurately.)
The action of the Board appears to be an attempt to censor the public from expressing alternative views. This is contrary to our democratic process. Also, frequent interruptions prefaced by “I don’t mean to interrupt, but…” are not conducive to open exchanges of ideas.
Furthermore, requiring in-person attendance at Board Meetings is contrary to government guidelines regarding group gatherings. Under NY State’s Phase IV guidelines, indoor public meetings must be limited to 50 attendees. Around 40 family units attended the November 4th Zoom meeting, with many of those units comprised of several family members. Thus, in order to comply with State guidelines, the Board would have to restrict attendance at its in-person meetings. Such actions would be counter to the purpose and nature of public hearings, and might actually be unlawful.
Thank you for your consideration of our comments. We sincerely hope that you will alter your policy and restore future meetings to open access via Zoom.
Sincerely,
Ron & Jean Ehmsen
326 South Shore Trail
Canada Lake (Caroga), NY
Dear Town Board and Town Clerk,
In the interest of increasing the number of residents who would like to attend Town Board meetings, and given the inability of many residents to attend meetings, either because of the Covid-19 public health risk or because they are seasonal, it seems to me that maximum accessibility and transparency can only be ensured by continuing to hold virtual meetings on zoom.
I am requesting that you reverse your recent decision and continue to make your meetings accessible via zoom.
Don Clark
327 Kassen Drive
Caroga Lake, NY 12032
Dear Town Board and Town Clerk,
Voting to stop Zoom in the middle of a pandemic seems an unwise decision to me!
It is not safe for me to attend meetings in town hall. I’m 83 with several medical issues. I believe that it is unwise for any senior to attend meetings in a closed room without a proper ventilation system.
The Town of Caroga is not zero free from Covid-19. In fact two of our citizens have died from it.
Just because other towns are meeting doesn’t mean that we have to. Keeping our citizens safe should be a top priority of the Board. The exposure recently of some Fulton County Supervisors to Covid should be further proof that more not less caution is needed.
I also hope that this decision has not been made to keep seasonal residents from being able to attend meetings. Seasonal residents have homes here, some living here for half the year. They pay full taxes and spend their money here that the Town of Caroga depends on. Offering Zoom is an easy way to involve residents of Caroga at town Board Meetings and show more good will from the Board. At this time, the Board’s decision appears to be an unnecessary, mean, spiteful one against all citizens of the Town of Caroga.
With the new development of some Fulton County Supervisors being exposed to Covid and having to isolate is a perfect time to reverse your decision from banning Zoom to restoring it!
Thank you for your service to this town,
Joyce S. Barrett
205 East Shore Road West Lake
Caroga Lake, NY 12032Home owner since 1987
Resident since 1992
Dear Town Board and Town Clerk,
To eliminate zoom access to the Board meetings will put many in harms way. Any person who is health compromised is now shut out from the meetings. How much does a Zoom meeting cost? We conduct Zoom meetings all the time. Surely, monies can be found in the budget.
Mary Cannon.
Dear Council Members,
Transparency is a hallmark of good government. Elected officials have a special duty to provide transparency of their proceedings. Having been an elected Town official in CT, I am well aware that this can sometimes be tedious or even painful — but that is no excuse for taking the easy road.
Please reinstate Zoom coverage of your meetings. You know it’s the right thing to do.
Regards,
Jim Meinhold
168 South Shore Rd
West Caroga Lake
This is to request that the Board reverse its November 4th decision to discontinue Zoom meetings. As a senior member of the community, I am forced by this decision to choose between my health and my right to participate in government. Zoom meetings are an easy alternative to protecting the public’s health during this pandemic (which has seen a recent uptick in Fulton County). There is no need to deprive the public of its right to participate in its government — a fundamental right of democracy. While Zoom meetings may be somewhat cumbersome, that inconvenience is far outweighed by the access afforded to citizens to have their voices heard by their government.
Janice Corr, 313 Kasson Drive
Dear Town Board and Town Clerk,
The residents of the Town of Caroga should be commended for their ability to all but eliminate the threat of COVID. Elsewhere in the country (especially New York State) the infection rate is increasing, but we have managed to put it in our rear view mirror.
I would assume that the town board will soon return all town offices (including the clerk’s office) to the pre pandemic routine. If 40+ people can gather without any concern then one on one should present no problem. This can easily be accomplished since it has become obvious that one vote on the town board automatically becomes 4.
I would encourage the board to explore the possibility of getting restrictions removed by USPS at our local post office. Also less restrictive rules for our local restaurants would be a great way to reward our residents for this unbelievable accomplishment.
Note to residents: in order to enjoy this new found freedom we must all refrain from not only venturing outside our town boundaries, but also don’t share this info with outsiders who might want to visit our little town and reverse the progress we have made.
Mark Ford
Dear Town Board and Town Clerk,
Some have suggested that my first Email regarding the board’s decision to terminate Zoom meetings was a letter of support. Let me be perfectly clear, I oppose this decision as well as the action the board has taken on the budget.
Many residents have made strong and convincing arguments against these recent board decisions. The board however has not been able (or desired)) to offer any convincing explanations to support their actions.
I find it hard to understand how 4 individuals can reach a conclusion so out of sync with the people who entrusted them to be their representatives. They do not want criticism. I get the impression that they feel our right to criticize through free speech just makes their job so much more difficult.
As a final note: does it appear to anyone else that our board is made up of two members who totally dislike one of their fellow members, and the remaining two just sit quietly waiting for instructions on how to vote?
Thanks for listening
Mark Ford
Dear Town Board and Town Clerk,
I understand the reasoning behind both ideas for online zoom meetings opposed to in person. My concern is for those residents in our community who have been life long residents but do not use computers. My questions are we not thinking about them? Why can’t we do both in person for a group of 50 or less socially distanced and masks and online with zoom for those who cannot or do not want to attend. For example do the regular session in person while someone does zoom on the computer. Many programs on television will have in person while zoom attendees are also involved. Problem solved. We need to bring our community together not divide. Here is an example of pros and cons of both.
I have researched and copied this to share with everyone and is just a point of view.
Advantages of face to face meetings when what a person is saying conflicts with what they may be thinking through body language. Help to provide sensitive feedback or bad news to individuals on a one to one basis. Avoid people multitasking, example working on computer while attending meeting, there is a better chance of getting attendees attention. There is no better way to have effective communication through face to face interactions. Body language is a huge factor in communications. Posture gestures, facial expressions and eye movements are best translated live. People also attend, not just for content but to meet other attendees and speakers with similar interests. The human factor and relationship building experience are the # 1 reason attend events.
I would also like to add why am I seeing the majority of emails from Canada Lake summer residents only? Question is what did they do prior to the ability to use zoom. Last note where are opinions of our permanent year round Caroga Lake residents like me, those of who would generally stay silent? Please involve yourself in your town. I feel we have lost our voices to only summer residents. I am not opposed to in person meetings. Finally what’s the big deal with in person when I’m sure majority of people are not living in their homes in a sterile bubble. How do you get food and other necessities. Why am i seeing lots of cars at restaurants and bars in town, golfers, boaters etc... Stop living in fear. Thank you again for letting me have freedom of speech.
Karen Dutcher
158 Morey Road
Caroga Lake NY
Dear Town Board and Town Clerk:
Okay, this is getting nuts!!
You jam a 17% tax increase on residents during an economic crisis, when it was utterly unnecessary, and then you cut off citizens’ rights and protections for safe participation in Town government.
One board member likens the use of zoom technology to “communism”. Communism is when you take away citizens’ rights and democratic participation!
As for your willful refusal to allow citizens protected participation in Town business, those of you who voted to do so better pray that no one gets sick, or dies, as a result.
Taken altogether, your actions come across to us as lunacy, or something worse.
We strongly urge you to reverse your decisions.
Chris and Kathy Rohrs
Dear Town Board and Town Clerk,
Hello. Seems to me that continuing virtual meetings is one of the Covid “coupons” we’ve all been given.
Doesn’t it allow more to follow, be involved, and perhaps offer positive nuggets to enhance life in Caroga?
It’s hard for me to understand why one wouldn’t accept potential gifts like this these days. Clarity and transparency are good...for all.
I hope this helps and thank you all for your efforts.
best
g
To the Town Board
While I understand the trying and unusual nature of Covid 19 and the varying directions received from the State and the CDC, I do not understand nor do I agree with any reason the Board may state in any effort to limit public access to and/or participate in any meeting of the Board or any of its related boards.
While it may be permissible in these Covid times to limit the numbers physically in attendance at meetings there is sufficient technology available that allows virtual participation regardless of time or number of attendees.
I work in an essential industry and since the onset of Covid we have found ways to communicate, maybe not as effectively as we would desire, but at least at a level that allows open communication.
I am dismayed that the Board would consider using Covid as an excuse to make decisions without proper taxpayer input, without open discussion.
I oppose any steps the Board may take to have any meeting without public participation be it virtual or in person.
On the subject of overriding the Tax Cap
All of our budgets are strained as a result of the additional demands put on us by the Covid outbreak. You may feel that you have adequate and explainable reasons for requiring a larger increase than normally allowed. But it is apparent from the transcripts of the Town meetings that the Board decided that an excess increase was a foregone conclusion, and did not really want to hear from the voters.
While I may have been talked into accepting a slight increase over the cap, the Board by its actions voted to increase taxes as much as they wanted or thought the could justify. I do not agree to this. If you truly need the money on a one-time basis, then tell us exactly how much you want from us. More than 1.6% is not good enough. Is it 2%, 5%, 10%?
The Board does need to balance the needs of the Town with needs of the taxpayers. Many, many people have been negatively impacted by Covid. My business is off 25% and I see no quick rebound. Many people are still furloughed or working short hours. These impacts are making it difficult for taxpayers to make their own budgets work.
My wife and I have been heartened in recent years at the resurgence of vitality in Caroga Lake. We were afraid when the Covid restrictions first hit that the gains made would be wiped out and then more. To the credit of the dedicated business owners most of them have found ways to survive, and most of them would credit their clientele for continuing to support them. Oh, and the clientele? Those very same taxpayers that you want more from.
Something will break.
We count on you, our elected representatives to measure the public good. Not just the Town good but the good of us, the taxpayers. Sometimes that can be related to only the Town but other times (like now) you need to evaluate a wider spectrum of impacts on the people you count on to keep the Town going.
Please don’t send the Town back into near oblivion with steep increases in closed businesses and unused homes. Find a way to encourage the people who are the Town.
P.S. Not having open meetings is not helping.
Mike & Kathy Oles
181 N Shore West Stoner Lake Rd
Dear Town Board and Town Clerk,
I am writing to express my opposition to the resolution passed at the close of the November 4th meeting to suspend the Zoom Access to Town Board meetings. It is disappointing that this action was taken without the item being on the agenda. When this action was first proposed in July, three members of the audience spoke in favor of continuing holding meetings virtually. At last week’s meeting, those present had no opportunity to voice their opinions on the proposed action. It is hoped that this board will reconsider their action given the outpouring of response against their actions.
While presenting the reasoning for this action, Supervisor Horton stated that “the town of Caroga has zero risk … virtually zero risk”. This is contrary to all of the advice of medical experts in this country and throughout the world. In fact, most are more concerned that there is nocontrol of the pandemic with the flu season approaching. New cases in the United States exceeded 100k four times last week.
With respect to near zero risk in this area, let us hope that the Fulton County Board of Supervisors remain Covid-free following their recent exposure necessitating the delay of their November 9th meeting. We can only hope that this experience highlights the care and caution necessary to keep the virus in check until such time as a vaccine becomes available. Yes, we are all tired of the sense of isolation from the past eight months, but this is NOT the time to become complacent. Heaven forbid if these actions should become a super-spreader event for Fulton County.
In terms of risk to the community, we have a practicing medical professional and a business person interacting with people daily serving on the board. Both represent a risk at possibly having been in contact with an asymptomatic Covid-19 positive individual during their daily activities. The link below documents the steady increase in the cumulative total of cases of the virus in Fulton County since the spike in April.
https://usafacts.org/visualizations/coronavirus-covid-19-spread-map/state/new-york/county/fulton-county
Additional comments made by Supervisor Horton supporting this Town Board action were that the use of Zoom access was to accommodate Councilmember Long. In my opinion, providing access to Town Board meetings was to accommodate the members of the community. With an influx of retirees that are making Caroga their homes, we have a community that is more susceptible to Covid-19.
It was quite inappropriate to single out Councilmember Long for his desire to not attend in person meetings during this crisis. Whether Councilmember Long is the only elected official who does not attend meetings in person or not is irrelevant and not a fact in evidence. The measures one feels necessary to protect one’s well-being during this pandemic are a personal matter. One could conclude that given the outpouring of responses against the action taken last week, there are many in this community that do not feel that attending public gatherings is safe.
Finally, in terms of government entities continuing to conduct business virtually, as Chairperson of the Zoning Board of Appeals, I will continue to conduct business virtually as long as Governor Cuomo’s Executive Orders remain in place. This is being done for the health and safety of myself and my family, those of my fellow board members and the members of our community.
Our community leaders should be setting an example and this is NOT the example to be set. I would ask for your thoughtful consideration in rescinding this resolution and reinstating Zoom access to Town Board Meetings.
The Public Officers Law, Section 103(c), provides a means by which board members can participate in the business of their board via teleconference. Governor Cuomo’s Executive Order 202.1 provides a means by which the business of government can be conducted in a safe manner by waiving the need to have the location of the teleconference site open to the public. This is all we are asking for.
It should be noted that Public Officers Law, Section 103(d) defines that these meetings can be open to “broadcast” under normal circumstances. It would seem, given the increased interest in the business of the town, that the board would be interested in continuing this access beyond the end of the pandemic.
Doug Purcell
Douglas H. Purcell, Jr.
ZBA Chairperson
P. O. Box 713
Caroga Lake, NY 12032
Dear Town Board and Town Clerk,
I oppose the board’s decision to stop town meetings via Zoom. COVID is still a very serious risk wherever you live and Zoom gives us a safer option. For those traveling and seasonal residents it’s now impossible to attend virtually. Please reconsider for all of us.
Thank you.
Sue Ringanese
I would like to see the zoom meetings brought back so that all Caroga residents can participate in the Town Hall meetings!
Dear Town Board and Town Clerk,
Please don’t stop the zoom meetings, I think it should continue regardless of the pandemic it gives the town residence an unique opportunity to attend meetings. It would show that you truly care about your residents. It has been working out fine. There are a lot who can’t get out especially in the winter who really want to attend but can’t.
Dear Town Board and Town Clerk,
As residents of Pine Lake during the months of May through October, it is very important to us to know what’s going on in the town during those months as well as throughout the year. That’s why we feel that it is very important that you continue the Zoom meetings so that summer residents who don’t live in Caroga during the winter months can be apprised of what is going on in the town. Caroga Lake is a unique community and summer residents, who pay taxes, who support the area in the summer, and who are affected by what’s going on in the community, should be able to be present during meetings. And with this available technology, it is easy to do.
I also feel that it is irresponsible to hold in-person meetings during a pandemic, particularly during the holiday season when there is more chance that visitors to the area could inadvertently bring in COVID and it could be spread further during these meetings. Also Fulton County is not immune to COVID, and it is more responsible to be as diligent as possible and utilize the available technology to make it safer for everyone.
I urge you to reconsider continuing the Zoom meetings in the future.
Please reply and let me know you received my email and will consider continuing this as part of your meetings.
Thanks,
Lorie & Ron Rosenberg
Dear Town Board and Town Clerk,
I am writing to thank you for providing safe access to the town meetings via zoom.
My gratitude is twofold:
1) Your effort to provide safe access to the process of governance and pertinent information to both tax payers and locally registered voters via zoom during the threat of the corona virus should commended for the clear message to your constituents — we matter. And our health and safety are of utmost concern.
2) Personally, the meeting made accessible via when I had my own mobility issues was profoundly helpful. Continuing to provide the zoom access to the meetings will ensure that residents with mobility issues will not be excluded from participating in our town affairs.
Respectfully submitted,
Nancy Long
Dear Town Board and Town Clerk,
I am deeply disappointed that you have chosen to stop the zoom meetings. In fact I was going to suggest continuing them indefinitely. Since we are not full time residents we have finally been able to be a part of the meetings and genuinely are excited to participate.
Please reconsider this decision.
Cindy Leinberg
Dear Town Board and Town Clerk,
Thank you all for deciding to return to a hybrid of in-person and Zoom meetings, keeping health and safety in mind.
I’m hoping that you will, however, continue to allow public comment. Hearing concerns and ideas from your constituents should be a priority. Public comment is a simple, but important, way to make people heard. It fosters feelings of transparency and can also give you important decision making tools.
I do agree that meetings can become way too long if there is a lot of public comment. Here is an easy way to keep public comment under control:
- Mute all attendees (except for the Board and the Town Clerk)
- Set and announce a time limit for each speaker and keep to it. Use an actual timer, unmute only the person called upon, then mute that speaker when his/her time is up. The meeting host can oversee this.
- Announce that the Board, while willing to listen, won’t respond to individual comments, but will consider them. All Supervisor Horton needs to do is thank each person for his/her comments and then move on to the next. Every Board has this capability. It’s commonly used and effective.
As an alternative, the Town Clerk could read all of the comments received prior to the meeting and made in Zoom chat during the meeting, at the Board meetings and add them to the minutes, or post them on the town website.
On another note, huge thanks to the Caroga Fire Department and the departments of the surrounding towns for their heroic efforts fighting the devastating fire that destroyed the golf course clubhouse. Very sad to lose that historic building.
Thank you. Hoping for better days to come for all of us.
Genia Meinhold
South Shore Road
W Caroga
Dear Town Board and Town Clerk,
Once again, the Town Supervisor, Scott Horton, is trying to stop the citizens of The Town of Caroga from exercising their rights to take part in a public Town Meeting! Just when I thought that Zoom would be allowed again for those who are isolating and are at risk of the covid-19 virus, we are put at risk again! The virus is escalating in numbers, not going down! I am very disturbed by this decision and it now looks like every time we turn around we are going to have to fight to be good, involved residents of The Town of Caroga!
Please resume the use of Zoom for all meetings!
Thank you,
Joyce S. Barrett
Dear Town Board and Town Clerk,
Why isn’t the emergency town board meeting accessible to your constituents? Zoom is cancelled again? What’s going on? Is there something to conceal in the process of making design and purchasing decisions? If the rebuild is an eyesore I wouldn’t want to be the one who gets all the blame. Sometimes a committee is necessary and practical. It is the responsibility of the entire board to make these types of decisions. You ran for the office, why don’t you do what you were elected to do. This isn’t a business you’re running, it is a community.
Thanks for listening,
Michael Hoffman
Dear Town Board and Town Clerk,
We want to see the Zoom meeting format be continued without the constant question of availability. It is not safe to be gathered in groups at this time. There is a plea every day for citizens to remain separated to protect each other. Each person needs to make a constant effort to do all we can to end this pandemic. At the same time, we all have a duty to be aware of our town’s activities. The Zoom format allows us to attend meetings safely. It also allows many people who are not winter residents to “attend” meetings. Please end this confusion and allow all people to “attend” meetings via Zoom.
Thank you for your consideration. We know you want to be transparent and the Zoom meetings help to achieve this end.
Yours, truly,
Doug & Judy Smith
143 Green Lake Road
Dear Town Board and Town Clerk,
First, our apologies for sending this notice to both your personal and town email addresses. We know this was a topic presented by the Town Clerk at the last monthly town board meeting, but are unaware of the outcome and if all parties have begun using the @caroga.town email addresses.
We had been waiting to see the notice of the emergency meeting in the Leader-Herald but have not seen it to date. It had been our hope that the Facebook postings and Caroga News Flash would be proven wrong and the official notice would indicate that Zoom access would be available for this emergency meeting.
Lacking evidence to the contrary, we find it incredulous that Zoom access would NOT be available within less than two weeks of the Town Board meeting where it was resolved to resume Zoom access for Town Board meetings. While the minutes of that meeting are not yet published and we do not have the exact wording of the resolution, we believe there is a reasonable expectation that the resolution was not meant to be limiting in terms of meetings of the Town Board.
Doug attended the November 10th meeting in person as it was the only option available to him for the purpose of seeking board approval for a proposed training session he desired to attend later that week. (As an aside, one thing he learned during that training is that he really did need Town Board approval of courses to be considered part of the required 4 hours of training annually (TL 267[7-a]; 271 [7-a]).) He did not stay beyond the public speaking portion of the meeting as he did not feel that it provided a safe environment during the current pandemic. The seats along the wall were pushing the six foot separation, air flow is notoriously bad in that building and not all board members correctly wore their masks covering both their nose and mouth. And while the Department of Health may advise that the county sheriff’s office should be called when the NYS guidelines are not being met, this does not meet our criteria for law enforcement involvement.
As stated in an earlier email, the measures one takes to protect oneself is a matter of personal choice. The fact that you as a body feel comfortable taking those risks does not preclude the personal choices of other citizens of the community that choose not to put themselves at risk, particularly when the guidelines to protect others are not being met.
While it may be too late for a change to this meeting, we can only hope that there will not be similar occurrences in the future.
Regards,
Doug & Nancy Purcell
Dear Town Board and Town Clerk,
All taxpayers and voters deserve transparency and full disclosure on your plans.
Please confirm that 5/11 mtg will be available via Zoom, especially with covid on the rise again.
Chris Rohrs
Dear Town Board and Town Clerk,
It appears that the upcoming Town meeting set for May 11 at 6 P.M. will not be transmitted via Zoom. Does this mean that the 12-person cap for attending the meeting has increased even with the uptick of Covid cases in our area?
Looking forward to hearing from you,
Deb Hoffman
Dear Town Board and Town Clerk,
Please provide Zoom access for the 20 May meeting. Also, can you clarify for Caroga taxpayers exactly:
1) How much insurance money has been received to date for the Clubhouse fire? And
2) What is the total projected cost of the new Clubhouse/Town Hall building?Thank you,
Barbara Russell
Hutchinson Road
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